[2014.01.29] Morning Musume - Egao no Kimi wa Taiyou sa / Kimi no Kawari wa Iyashinai / What is LOVE? (single)

[Anderei]

It was a 2 hour event, but MM didn't show up until the last half hour. 

[JPope]

I love the song, period.
 
I wish they would have shown the dance head-on at eye level or a bit below on the first chorus, as that formation is pretty cool and really needs to be seen from that angle. Shooting it with a rising shot kind of destroys the impact of it.

[Derby]

I'm not happy with this performance. They sounded way better on Hey! Hey! Hey!, this was kind of, emotionless?
Riho's voice is so "when everyone hated me during Help Me!!-Buresuto because my singing was horrible, and I'm doing it again".
Also, I haven't read the lyrics until now, this is not Olympic at all lol, maybe the only part that we should consider is the chorus. But I still loving the song
 
And btw how is that Sato is the only frontgirl without a solo? She was super-centered in What is LOVE? and here she's really on 2nd plane

[rallyleo]

The performance was pretty meh, but Sakura killed it more that usual.
 
Listen to her "IRONY" line - her vibrato is starting to develop rather nicely!

[Farrah]

I don't get how this song is about a boy, LOL? 99% of the lyrics are about believing in yourself / working hard / making your loved ones proud.  There's a few iffy lines but it's hardly standard "when will senpai notice me~" idol lyrics.

[TicTacAnyone]

[quote="Farrah"]
I don't get how this song is about a boy, LOL? 99% of the lyrics are about believing in yourself / working hard / making your loved ones proud.  There's a few iffy lines but it's hardly standard "when will senpai notice me~" idol lyrics.
[/quote]
 
"His words are honest, he's serious when he's hitting on you." "His smile is honest, he charms everybody." "LOVE" "I will devote this life to the person I love" And, if you want to take it that way, "There's no one that can replace you".... I admit, I was probably over exaggerating, but it just feels so weird to have those parts in the song. But I also don't believe that 99% of the song is about believing in yourself XD Like, couldn't Tsunku have said something about the landscape of Japan or its people or something, idk lol. 

[NekoKaiSai]

I agree with Farrah, there's really only four lines that aren't Olympic-y.  I really like this song, and the instrumental especially.  I think What is LOVE? is still my favorite, but this is definitely a close second.
 
[quote="Derby"]
I'm not happy with this performance. They sounded way better on Hey! Hey! Hey!, this was kind of, emotionless?
Riho's voice is so "when everyone hated me during Help Me!!-Buresuto because my singing was horrible, and I'm doing it again".
Also, I haven't read the lyrics until now, this is not Olympic at all lol, maybe the only part that we should consider is the chorus. But I still loving the song
 
And btw how is that Sato is the only frontgirl without a solo? She was super-centered in What is LOVE? and here she's really on 2nd plane
[/quote]
 
We got a much better recording of Hey! x3, so it could be because of that.
 
Masaki is not a front girl, she's second tier and even that is a recent development.  Ayumi is still more of a front girl than Masaki.

[Derby]

[quote="NekoKai"]
We got a much better recording of Hey! x3, so it could be because of that.
 
Masaki is not a front girl, she's second tier and even that is a recent development.  Ayumi is still more of a front girl than Masaki.
[/quote]
 
Sorry, I thought it's Riho as center and the 5 vocals as front girls
Can someone explain me what a front girl is? and how the current line-up is divided in tiers?
I always thought they were just the non-devoted and non-ignored members

[Trinu]

The center thing is for AKB, not MM.
Here we just have a couple of members who sing more than the rest. In this song, Riho and Sakura. And that's that.

[MejraThea]

I would kind of look at it as....
 
              /\
      Riho, Sakura
            /    \
Ayumi, Mizuki, Sayumi
          /        \
    Haruna, Masaki
        /             \
 Haruka, Kanon, Erina
 
In a way. They are exceptions to this, and it is my pinon, based upon Kimi no Kawari (not just lines, but overall presence). Factoring in Egao no Kimi and and What Is LOVE is something that my Just-finished-math-homework brain is not yet ready for.
I'm considering not even posting this for whatever backlash it might ensue, but I think I'm thinking of H!O

[momoirosaya]

Edit: Oh it seems someone already replied, oh well :P
 
[quote="Trinu"]
The center thing is for AKB, not MM.
Here we just have a couple of members who sing more than the rest. In this song, Riho and Sakura. And that's that.
[/quote]
It's not just AKB, even Riho herself and other girls refer to her as 'center' of MM
'Center' just really means the person who dances in the center of the group, it's does not mean that they are face of the group, although in most cases the face is the center
 
[quote="Derby"]
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="NekoKai" data-cid="170227" data-time="1390252894">
<div>
We got a much better recording of Hey! x3, so it could be because of that.
 
Masaki is not a front girl, she's second tier and even that is a recent development.  Ayumi is still more of a front girl than Masaki.
[/quote]
 
Sorry, I thought it's Riho as center and the 5 vocals as front girls
Can someone explain me what a front girl is? and how the current line-up is divided in tiers?
I always thought they were just the non-devoted and non-ignored members
 
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Front girls usually get a majority of the lines, are featured most (in both singles and TV), in the front for dancing, etc.
 
MM's Front Girls: Riho, Sakura,
Second: Ayumi, Sayumi, Masaki, Mizuki

Third: Erina, Kanon, Haruna, Haruka

 
Ayumi is second, but they've been pushing her more front now because of her dancing, so in terms of singing she's 2nd, but in terms of dancing she's 1st. I think Sayu is more 2nd than first because they're trying to show of the new girls more than her. Sayu is kind of on a league all her own when it comes to things outside of H!P (like TV appearances), because she is the most well known. Feel free to disagree with me!
 

Spoiler: [+]

I think Platinum era had the easiest to understand system
First: Ai, Reina
Second: Risa, Eri
Third: Sayumi, Koharu
Fourth: JunJun, LinLin, Aika

[showraniy]

[quote="Saya"]
Edit: Oh it seems someone already replied, oh well :P
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Trinu" data-cid="170266" data-time="1390267318">
<div>
The center thing is for AKB, not MM.
Here we just have a couple of members who sing more than the rest. In this song, Riho and Sakura. And that's that.
[/quote]
It's not just AKB, even Riho herself and other girls refer to her as 'center' of MM
'Center' just really means the person who dances in the center of the group, it's does not mean that they are face of the group, although in most cases the face is the center
 
</div>
</blockquote>
 
The "center" thing really came up in an interview around the time the girls were promoting Help Me and some dipshit interviewer asked the girls who the center was. This, to me, was influenced directly by AKB and is about AKB. MM has had centers just as you say, but there has never been a "center" the way this guy was asking it, as in who's the center of the whole group all the time. That's definitely Maeda Atsuko, whose face was the center of every song. Rika was the center of The Peace, but other than that I can never think of a time where a girl was the literal center of the dance and had enough solo lines to be counted as more than just a lead dancer. I don't really know who's in the center of dances at any point, to be honest. It's more of who's in the foreground, isn't it? I'm thinking specifically of Only You here where Ai and Reina were up front, but flanking the actual visual center of the dance (which probably changed frequently).
 
But this will probably take much more attention paid to the dances/videos/performances than I've done to really make a point. I just feel like center is an entirely AKB thing that people keep trying to apply to MM because AKB = idols = MM, e'rrybody's totally the same thing right?

 

[Anderei]

Right now, since there's 10 girls and it's all formation based, they technically don't have a center.
 
Edit: More promo. Fortunemusic is doing a third round of ordering until the 23rd. You can buy one edition that comes with a handshake ticket or a boxset that comes with a photo op ticket. They've also added another handshake for 4/26, which brings the count for this single up to 30 I think.

[momoirosaya]

 ^Yeah, but Riho and Ayumi always end up in the middle for the big parts (not just talking about the dance breaks)
 
[quote="showraniy"]
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Saya" data-cid="170270" data-time="1390268980">
<div>
Edit: Oh it seems someone already replied, oh well :P
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Trinu" data-cid="170266" data-time="1390267318">
<div>
The center thing is for AKB, not MM.
Here we just have a couple of members who sing more than the rest. In this song, Riho and Sakura. And that's that.
[/quote]
It's not just AKB, even Riho herself and other girls refer to her as 'center' of MM
'Center' just really means the person who dances in the center of the group, it's does not mean that they are face of the group, although in most cases the face is the center
 
</div>
</blockquote>
 
The "center" thing really came up in an interview around the time the girls were promoting Help Me and some dipshit interviewer asked the girls who the center was.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
I actually first heard it in a behind the scenes video around the time of 123, and Riho was saying that it is hard being center and she'll have to pull the group along, stuff like that.
 
 
Edit: Full Clip of MM at the Olympics thing (they also sing Love Machine)

[JPope]

Morning Musume has almost always had one or (usually) two members who were understood to be center(s):
 
<div>Natsumi Abe/Asuka Fukuda</div>
<div>Natsumi Abe/Maki Goto</div>
<div>Natsumi Abe/Kaori Iida</div>
<div>Kaori Iida/Miki Fujimoto</div>
<div>Miki Fujimoto/ Ai Takahashi</div>
<div>Ai Takahashi/Reina Tanaka</div>
<div>Reina Tanaka/Risa Niigaki</div>
<div>Reina Tanaka/Riho Sayashi</div>
<div>Riho Sayashi/Sakura Oda</div>
<div> </div>
<div>There might be exceptions to the above, but it's close enough to accurate to serve as a guide. Maybe they weren't always referred to as a "center," but that's a distinction without a difference. Would a center by any other name hog fewer lines?</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Also, I feel like I just did this.  </div>

[Anderei]

What song were Kaori and Miki both up front and super noticeable in?

[JPope]

Oh, so this only counts for singles? I'm not sure of the rules you're using here.
 
Also, note the "there are exceptions" part. 

[Anderei]

Yeah, nowadays I mostly think of front girls as people who are (usually) popular and get most of the solos.

[Zoe]

They were most certainly using "center" terminology long before AKB48, though it was less about the number of lines and more about the focus of the choreography and promo materials. The Peace~Mr Moonlight~Sou da era was well known for the rotating centers.

[JPope]

So being front and center and getting more lines than the rest in concerts doesn't count?

[TicTacAnyone]

Do you guys do "debate" threads?? If so, I think this topic would be good. Not sure how many replies about this it takes until it could be its own thread...??

[Anderei]

[quote="JPope"]
So being front and center and getting more lines than the rest in concerts doesn't count?
[/quote]
 
The girls getting the lines in the singles get most of the lines in the concerts too when it comes to distributing lines that belonged to people who are gone. Especially since even the album songs are usually lead by the same people who lead the singles unless it's a subgroup song. I guess Sayumi fits into what you're talking about. She's gotten a lot of lines since Ai/Risa/Reina/Eri left.

[andrewmarlin]

For the lack of time I have, the song is 99% about what the Olympics are and what it means to be a part. Very inspirational. Now the boy parts are a bit confusing unless the Olympics are someone they love? I really am enjoying this single

[Derby]

Thank you all for the replies!
Even when some of you say that the "center" is a AKB thing, I think Riho can be considered as center (lines, dance, popularity, focus, etc.)
 
 
 
[quote="TicTacAnyone"]
Do you guys do "debate" threads?? If so, I think this topic would be good. Not sure how many replies about this it takes until it could be its own thread...??
[/quote]
 
omg stop posting pls, whenever I see you I can't stop staring at that gif :____ she's SO FCUKIN FLUFYY CUTE OMG!!!! I've already saved it 4 or 5 times, even when I just can save it once. I'm really stupid

[momoirosaya]

[quote="TicTacAnyone"]
Do you guys do "debate" threads?? If so, I think this topic would be good. Not sure how many replies about this it takes until it could be its own thread...??
[/quote]

We do when it starts to get off topic of the thread, and starts taking up a couple pages. This one is is pretty small, so it is okay here for now.

[eri]

Hm, so this is an Olympic event? The glow sticks threw me off for a second. 
 
And...eh? This conversation is confusing.  Center = "face" = lead, it all obviously means the same thing.  It is the girl who gets the most media presence and featuring in the song, dance, PV, interviews, photographs or whatever.  Since she acts as the face of the group, they often put her literally in the center of the photographs or in the choreography.
 
I don't care about AKB but Abe Natsumi was the clear and obvious "center" of the group until Maki and Ishikawa started to be pushed.  When they put Ishikawa as the voice/center spot for The Peace, news outlets made a huge deal that Morning Musume was changing their center/lead girl again.  
 
[quote="JPope"]Natsumi Abe/Asuka Fukuda</div>
<div>Natsumi Abe/Maki Goto</div>
<div>Natsumi Abe/Kaori Iida</div>
<div>Kaori Iida/Miki Fujimoto</div>
<div>Miki Fujimoto/ Ai Takahashi</div>
<div>Ai Takahashi/Reina Tanaka</div>
<div>Reina Tanaka/Risa Niigaki</div>
<div>Reina Tanaka/Riho Sayashi</div>
<div>Riho Sayashi/Sakura Oda</div>
<div> [/quote]
 
 
I'd just disagree and say that Iida was never EVER a center and arguably, Fujimoto wasn't really "Center" either.  That should all go to Ishikawa.  
 
ANYWAY, I really like the current line up because they don't really have a center.  I think it is the way that dancing has become more important for this phase of MM. Strong dancers aren't always the strong singers so things feel a little more equally distributed in terms of attention.  The dance sequences also seem to promote a more "uniform" group.
 
This performance is nice because you can appreciate how good their dancing has become.  Too bad the song itself still blows.  I can't tell the difference much with the robotic chanting voices of What is Love.     
 
 

[Anderei]

This is the other part with them doing the new Love Machine and a short talk segment.
 
Heyx3 was much better promo than this. I don't think this will have much impact on them at all.

[JPope]

[quote="eri"]
Hm, so this is an Olympic event? The glow sticks threw me off for a second. 
 
And...eh? This conversation is confusing.  Center = "face" = lead, it all obviously means the same thing.  It is the girl who gets the most media presence and featuring in the song, dance, PV, interviews, photographs or whatever.  Since she acts as the face of the group, they often put her literally in the center of the photographs or in the choreography.
 
I don't care about AKB but Abe Natsumi was the clear and obvious "center" of the group until Maki and Ishikawa started to be pushed.  When they put Ishikawa as the voice/center spot for The Peace, news outlets made a huge deal that Morning Musume was changing their center/lead girl again.  
 
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="JPope" data-cid="170282" data-time="1390274302">
Jpope

 
Morning Musume has almost always had one or (usually) two members who were understood to be center(s):
 
<div>Natsumi Abe/Asuka Fukuda</div>
<div>Natsumi Abe/Maki Goto</div>
<div>Natsumi Abe/Kaori Iida</div>
<div>Kaori Iida/Miki Fujimoto</div>
<div>Miki Fujimoto/ Ai Takahashi</div>
<div>Ai Takahashi/Reina Tanaka</div>
<div>Reina Tanaka/Risa Niigaki</div>
<div>Reina Tanaka/Riho Sayashi</div>
<div>Riho Sayashi/Sakura Oda</div>
<div> [/quote]
 
 
I'd just disagree and say that Iida was never EVER a center and arguably, Fujimoto wasn't really "Center" either.  That should all go to Ishikawa.  
 
 
</div>
</blockquote>
 
In hindsight, you're probably right about Iida, but you are absolutely wrong about Fujimoto. She was brought into the group specifically to fill the STAR void left by Maki Goto's graduation. Her job description from day one was "Center." She was given a ton of lines in both new and old songs, and took on a leadership role almost immediately. Ishikawa was a second-tier "center" based on lines and a first-tier "face-of-the-group" based on everything else, so I can see adding her into the mix.
 
You can argue the accuracy of my list, and that's fine, but my greater point stands, which is that Morning Musume has pretty much always had girls that filled the role defined by the current term "center." The period between Abe and Takahashi seems to be the only one where there is any real debate about this. The concept is neither new to MM nor is it stolen from AKB.

[pandapanda]

I just noticed in the MV they don't do the cool Olympic rings-arm move. 

[Trinu]

Thank god, that move is tacky as hell.
 
Anyway, if they do use the center thing, then let them lol
In the 10 years I've been a fan Ive never heard nor read anything about "center" applied to MM... front girls, yeah, but center? Never. :/